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Offline CC-Coder

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CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« on: April 16, 2019, 10:43:48 AM »
I went ahead and bought a Power Bank last week. Iíll use it to recharge the USB devices including GoPro, headlamps and iPhones. It will also be handy to jumpstart  the car and Mokai batteries. Knowing myself, Iíll probably drain the batteries at some point, or lock my keys in the car while weíre in the middle of nowhere. Lol
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 10:54:15 AM by CC-Coder »
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Offline happul3

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2019, 12:14:23 PM »
Looks like a useful addition to a Mokai toolbag, but I wouldn't count on this device jumpstarting any real car.

Offline Jpmichigan

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2019, 09:53:30 AM »
I use this also - it will jumpstart a V8 toyota Sequoya at least 3 times.   Nice addition... the one I have you can use the aux port to charge it up and since it has 2 USB ports you've basically given yourself an emergency answer and a convenient way to charge devices.

Offline CC-Coder

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2019, 04:41:03 PM »
Yep. My brother and nephew have used it multiple times. I donít think it will recharge a bad battery, just send juice to the alternator/starter?
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Offline happul3

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2019, 05:22:55 PM »
You think that itty-bitty unit can start V8 engine on its own? More likely scenario is that the battery was not entirely dead and the powerbank charged it temporarily just enough to turn the engine. 

Offline Painlesstom

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2019, 05:42:18 PM »
Considering we are here about Mokais, the power bank would easily jump one several times. It can jump a car though, several videos online demonstrate that they do in fact work.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6rG1Q8rc58" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6rG1Q8rc58</a>
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Offline happul3

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2019, 03:07:46 PM »
Note that I was answering someone else's  question about whether it "just send juice to the alternator/starter" in a V8, not about starting a Mokai, which no one doubted in this thread.

For what it is worth, I think it is pretty naive to think that little Lipo can start a large engine on its own. And the video you included demonstrates something different:  that a weak/discharged battery can be helped by this unit. OK, but it likely wouldn't work if the battery were truly dead, as in battery-that-can't-be-charged-above-10V. 

Offline Painlesstom

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2019, 05:02:16 PM »
I don't think anyone ever said it would jump start a car engine alone, JP said he used it to jump his v8 three times and it worked so there isn't anything to argue about there, I doubt the battery was toast.. just needed a boost. Bottom line, it's an asset if you find your battery needs assistance.

And don't short change the Lipo, those "little" batteries can pack a big punch. We use 12v electric starter for RC engines sometimes, hooked to a car battery that's fully charged and nothing wrong with it, it will barely crank over a 30cc 2 stroke... BUT, hook at 4 cell 4000mah lipo to the same motor and it will crank it over twice as fast. So a lipo is capable of packing more punch that a car battery and I have no doubt that one the right size would crank a V8 over easily while being a fraction of the size and weight of the car battery.

Watch this little 3s lipo do it's thing.. lol https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNqSgUXBr0w

And a 5s.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fJptOL6wlU

And here is one starting a v6 all by itself. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcr_sfHnuko
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Offline happul3

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2019, 03:45:09 PM »
I couldn't find teardown on exact unit CC-Coder have, but here is one for a similar, slightly more expensive and higher current rated unit 1000Amp - Noco GB40.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlRqu-Iwd0g
The important information in that video is the components of the power circuit - there are three actually: battery Li 3s 2.1Ah, which looks like a usual RC battery, I am guessing 30C at best - 60Amp; relay - 70Amp rated; 4 Schottky diodes 40 Amp rated (to prevent alternator from blowing Li battery after car starts). There is no circuitry capable of temporarily boosting current in a safe manner, like a supecapacitor, for example. So the 1000Amp official rating is pure BS. The unit may deliver more than 70Amps, sure, but that means that all the important components are severely over-stressed. I can envision pretty spectacular fireworks if one of the diodes fails-closed and the modern car alternator brings that Li battery to 15V. Perhaps even worse scenario is a stealthy one. Li battery is damaged by extreme discharge current catches fire a while after, when the unit is being recharged at home.

So whenever it is being used to start a big engine it is essentially a lottery with outcome dependent on the state of car battery. You would not win much though, but can lose a lot..

Offline Painlesstom

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2019, 04:06:21 PM »
Never said it was a viable lead-acid battery replacement, said a lipo was capable of starting the engine and provided video examples of that being done in response to your statement that lipo couldn't start an engine on it's own. I'm very familiar with the nature of these batteries, I have dozens of them I've been using and maintaining for many years. They have their limitations and safe handling procedures, but they aren't the stick of dynamite many make them out to be. lol
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Offline Larry

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2019, 06:05:39 PM »
I have one but it couldn't start my V6 Ford Ranger.

Offline happul3

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #11 on: April 29, 2019, 10:05:26 PM »
Actually, the Li batteries *are* perfectly viable as car starting battery, used in some very high end/expensive cars. So it is not at all surprising that a large enough Li battery (8Ah, that's ~200 Amps rated current, I guess) connected directly without a relay or diode can start a V6 on its own. But we weren't discussing Li batteries in general. The subject is tiny gadgets, such as Gooloo 800Amp, that is claimed to have capabilities that are just incredible for their size.  In reality, it is mostly BS and potentially dangerous one. I wonder what would be safe handling procedure for something that's built with multiple components 10x under-rated current? Not to use it for starting cars would be a good one.

I hope someone will sue the bastards selling this crap. However, seeing that www.gooloo.com website does not list any location/address/phone at all, it is just a wishful thinking.

 

Offline CC-Coder

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #12 on: April 29, 2019, 11:34:45 PM »
Costco has one for sell in the store and this Duracell model online.

This jump starter boasts 1100 peak amps to jumpstart up to 8 cylinder / 5.0L engines. It also features Safe Jump technology that prevents sparking and protects against reverse polarity, reverse current, short circuits and overheating.

Jump-starts V8 Engines Up to 25 Times on a Single Charge
Jump-starts your car, truck and much more. Safely and easily starts all types of 12V lead-acid batteries, including trucks, cars, hybrid starter batteries, boats, motorcycles and personal watercraft.

Duracell 1100 Peak Amp Lithium-Ion Emergency Jump Starter
https://www.costco.com/Duracell-1100-Peak-Amp-Lithium-Ion-Emergency-Jump-Starter.product.100422430.html
« Last Edit: April 29, 2019, 11:43:14 PM by CC-Coder »
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Offline happul3

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #13 on: May 01, 2019, 01:46:02 PM »
Do you really think that this Duracell unit is significantly different from the Noco's that was disassembled in video I linked? Duracell does not have a magic way of sourcing sufficiently rated components in such a tiny package. Otherwise it'd be very nice.  For the same $69 as Gooloo, one can gets even 1100 Amps "peak current" and start V8s. Funny that the electric specification section of the manual says nothing like that. Duracell must be trying to keep at least some semblance of integrity.

To keep it clear, I do not claim that these units are useless or not worth their money. They must be fine as power banks and for starting small engines. They might be even helpful for large automotive engines if the main battery is not completely discharged/dead. Beyond that they might simply not work, or they might break down, or they might even catch fire in process or during subsequent charging. The last scenario is not too likely, but I would not take that risk knowing what's inside. But the aggressively misleading way they are advertised is something else...

Offline Painlesstom

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Re: CW-Battery Jump Starter / Charger
« Reply #14 on: May 01, 2019, 02:06:41 PM »
But the aggressively misleading way they are advertised is something else...

That can be applied to just about everything these days..... this marketing model is the norm now.
Tom

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