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Offline CC-Coder

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #15 on: September 03, 2017, 03:13:34 AM »
I'm pretty close to sea level, roughly 50-75' on the river, so that same motor ran at 1000' would be rich and could potentially have idle issues. What elevation are you at?

Elevation in video:
Elevation for Conneaut, Oh is 564 feet

Elevation where Her's sputtered (5) times in 20 miles.
Elevation for Cleveland, Oh is 606 feet


https://pubs.usgs.gov/gip/Elevations-Distances/elvadist.html

Cleveland is #18 @ 1050 (high), 571 (low)


Elevation for Ludowici, Ga is 75 feet

Reference:
http://veloroutes.org/elevation/?location=Cleveland%2C+Oh&units=e
« Last Edit: September 03, 2017, 03:26:24 AM by CC-Coder »
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Offline Larry

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #16 on: September 03, 2017, 10:01:14 AM »
We don't know if the idle speed is the problem until you adjust and retest. Cooler temps shouldn't have any negative effect whatsoever, but altitude certainly could, not necessarily on idle speed but mixture of the main jet. I'm hoping bumping the idle up will solve your problem, the engines run great other than right off full throttle to idle.

Any Subaru could have carb problems, it's a lawnmower engine in a boat. These motors were never intended to be "driven", and the carbs were designed for use with a gravity feed tank. Using a fuel pump on them, and requiring them to have a nice idle and throttle response, is pushing their ability to the max.  I've figured out a lot of tricks to help make them run better than ever, but sometimes something pops up as a mystery to solve.
Does the Honda have the same issues ?

Offline CC-Coder

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #17 on: September 03, 2017, 10:38:19 AM »
Does the Honda have the same issues ?

Not sure, I think we're trying out different theories to fix the problem, which isn't a big issue for me at this point. Both boats run great with just a hiccup every once in a while. I was thinking if sea level has anything to do with the pressure inside the engine, I may have to turn my idle up after initial break-in of the motors.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2017, 10:40:00 AM by CC-Coder »
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Offline CC-Coder

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #18 on: September 03, 2017, 07:09:23 PM »
If you look at the engine from the valve cover side, the plug will be to the right and then you'll look down and to the right of that and the carburetor lever will be in view with the idle speed screw sticking out. Turn it in 1/8th turn clockwise to raise the idle a little. If you raise it too much you will hear the clutch engage, you don't want that, and you will need to back it down a hair. Try that and see if there is any improvement.

Tom,
Do I need to take the engine out?
You should use Skype to diagnose problems, like tele-medicine for engines.
Of coarse you could send a bill after the diagnosis.  :))

« Last Edit: September 03, 2017, 07:14:10 PM by CC-Coder »
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Offline Painlesstom

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #19 on: September 04, 2017, 01:57:06 AM »
Elevation in video:
Elevation for Conneaut, Oh is 564 feet

Elevation where Her's sputtered (5) times in 20 miles.
Elevation for Cleveland, Oh is 606 feet


https://pubs.usgs.gov/gip/Elevations-Distances/elvadist.html

Cleveland is #18 @ 1050 (high), 571 (low)


Elevation for Ludowici, Ga is 75 feet

Reference:
http://veloroutes.org/elevation/?location=Cleveland%2C+Oh&units=e


You might want to turn the idle mixture screw in 1/8th of a turn to lean the low side to compensate. That is on top of the carb just behind the fuel inlet.

Does the Honda have the same issues ?

I didn't have the Honda long enough to know, and pretty much everyone who has problems with them now just convert over the the Subaru... So couldn't say for sure.

Tom,
Do I need to take the engine out?
You should use Skype to diagnose problems, like tele-medicine for engines.
Of coarse you could send a bill after the diagnosis.  :))



Yes, it's easier to access that screw with the engine out. I typically just pull it forward and out of the mount, then adjust and lock back in place, that way I don't have to undo all the linkage etc...
Tom

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Offline CC-Coder

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #20 on: September 04, 2017, 06:04:03 PM »

You might want to turn the idle mixture screw in 1/8th of a turn to lean the low side to compensate. That is on top of the carb just behind the fuel inlet.

I didn't have the Honda long enough to know, and pretty much everyone who has problems with them now just convert over the the Subaru... So couldn't say for sure.

Yes, it's easier to access that screw with the engine out. I typically just pull it forward and out of the mount, then adjust and lock back in place, that way I don't have to undo all the linkage etc...
Mission accomplished, will test after wind and rain from last weeks Gulf hurricane moves through.
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Offline CC-Coder

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UPDATE: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2017, 12:19:27 AM »
Mission accomplished, will test after wind and rain from last weeks Gulf hurricane moves through.

Tested the 1/8 turn (idle mixture screw) to each engine...Problem Resolved!
Very pleased it wasn't dirt in the carb or water in the gas.
Plus, got to check out the Pittsburgh sites on another perfect day without any sputtering issues.

Thanks Tom!  :) :)
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Offline Painlesstom

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2017, 11:54:37 AM »
Excellent, glad to hear that!  \./8
Tom

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Offline Maritimer

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #23 on: September 13, 2017, 09:57:20 PM »
Can you please post a photo of the mixture screw location. I see the brass pilot jet (I believe that's what it is) but I don't see the mixture screw. I may be suffering from male pattern blindness (the inability to see things right in front of my eyes).

Offline Painlesstom

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #24 on: September 13, 2017, 10:10:50 PM »
Some models don't have a visible screw, there would be a brass plug in the hole instead. It is right behind that air bleed jet that is on top. That plug must be extracted to access the screw, not recommended to try that yourself unless you have a drill press and end mill the correct size to drill it out. If anyone wants to send their carb to me, I will remove the plug at no charge other than return shipping.

I don't have any pictures handy right now, but will take a couple when I'm out in the shop again.
Tom

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Offline Maritimer

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #25 on: September 14, 2017, 08:47:27 AM »
Thanks, as always. I think I'll leave well enough alone for now and not overtune this.

== Steve ==

Offline CC-Coder

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #26 on: October 12, 2018, 11:16:07 PM »
I have been chasing a stalling issue for the past year with Tom's help. Although, I haven't had any problems restarting my Mokai each time it stalled out, the problem becomes bothersome and kind of makes me want to keep to local trips. Having my wife along on trips with her Mokai provides for a nice towing option.  :)
 
Seems I would always stall when coming off full throttle. Once I got back down to idle, I would need to rev the throttle in order not to stall out. Some theories were my higher elevation here in Cleveland compared to Georgia, so we raised the idle 1/8 turn. Seemed to fix it for awhile, but a few trips later, same exact issue.
Next, we thought it may have been water in the gas. So I bought new gas cans, siphon and kept the process super clean. We bought non-ethonol fuel from a wholesale distributor that supplies most of the marinas along Lake Erie, still happened every so often.
We thought the problem was solved after we found a gasket had deteriorated and pieces went into the carb. Still, you guessed it, the problem returned.
This year, I've only had this issue happen 2 or 3 times since May.
So after a trip last week, I refilled the gas tank, changed the oil, filled to the correct level and tried to start it up...cranked fine but would not turn over.
So I messaged Tom and he told me to clean the carb myself, with the help of his easy how-to video. 
So I thoroughly cleaned it out with carb cleaner, put it back together and...same thing, cranks but no go. While I'm turning the key, I noticed gas dripping ever so slowly from the 1 inch piece of hose connecting the fuel filter to the carb. I ran up to the auto parts store and replaced it with a new piece and WALLA, started right up. Nice big smile on this Novices's face!

Hopefully, this will be my final issue with stalling. But, it is a Boat!  ::) Lol
« Last Edit: October 12, 2018, 11:19:46 PM by CC-Coder »
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Offline Painlesstom

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #27 on: October 12, 2018, 11:25:40 PM »
Glad it's running again, but a leak like you described wouldn't stop the engine from starting. There is 4 psi of pressure in that line and a slow drip is just that. As for the persistent stalling issue, it only does it up there for you. I've run that engine, and carb, and it was solid as a rock after coming off full throttle, couldn't make it stall. That's why I kept thinking it was altitude, your fuel, or something else directly related to being up there. Hope the cleaning gets the job done, keep us posted.  ;)
Tom

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Offline CC-Coder

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue? (Update)
« Reply #28 on: February 04, 2019, 09:22:01 PM »
We think the issue with my Mokai stalling might finally be resolved. Sent my carb down to Tom, along with a couple of cracked windshields and the muffler for his latest upgrade. Received them back today and had the cats help with the UnBoxing. After a few river tests with both the old and new carb, the issue seems to be resolved. We speculated in this thread it might be bad gas, elevation above sea level, fuel pump or filter. I had sent my engine down to Ga last year and we thought the problem was fixed but, it came back with a vengeance. We think the carb was bad and Tom replaced it with a new one. The stalling issue always happened while coming off plane from full throttle down to idle. Although it would always restart, it was very annoying to deal with feathering the throttle in order to keep it running. Now I can breathe easier and take some long, long Mokai trips. Hurry up Spring!  :)

Carb Test 1 - https://youtu.be/a__BfSgL8q0

Carb Test 2 - https://youtu.be/-j2Y_I6qHZg


« Last Edit: February 04, 2019, 09:26:08 PM by CC-Coder »
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Offline CC-Coder

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Re: CW-Water In Gas Issue?
« Reply #29 on: April 12, 2019, 11:07:46 AM »
Tom,
  Since putting the motor back together and getting the Mokaiís back outside where they belong, mine fired up on the first try.  Hoping and expecting my stalling issue is fixed for good. 🤞
Looks like Wedís will be the earliest for a water test. Itís been either to cold, rainy or the element that stops me from getting out the most...The Wind.
🤦🏼‍♂️ Chuck 🤷🏻‍♂️